Children In Restaurants

[unclepat]

This issue has been a hot potato for the last few weeks with some restaurants going as far as banning children altogether and others expressing what have clearly been strongly held views that they were previously reluctant to share for fear of offending people.
I'll be very interested to hear people's views on this subject because it seems to polarise people completely and as I am due to cross the rubicon into parenthood in next few months, I am wondering will my opinions change over time.
My own view is that there is a time and a place. Time wise I think lunch and early evening is fine, but after that should be adult time. Place involves bringing your children to a suitable restaurant.
The majority of children, and parents, are perfectly fine but there are a couple of issues which we have come up against regularly over the last five years which cause problems.
The first is parents with crying babies at night time. This is unfair on the other guests and must be stressful for the parents themselves. We always request the parents take the baby out to pacify and this can be met with mixed responses. Our tolerence of this much shorter at night as I think it's unfair of parents to have crying babies in restaurants at 8 or 9 pm when others may have paid baby sitters to get away from that very thing for a few hours.
The second is parents demanding anything from nuggets and chips, to garlic bread and pizza and then complaining when we don't have them. With the number of restaurants within walking distance of us catering specifically for families, it never ceases to amaze me. A bit of research before leaving the house would save all concerned, especially the parents, a lot of unecessary stress.
The flip side is that I've been in Michelin starred restaurants and seen children have dinner with their parents and eat whatever is on the menu. I guess the key is to know your child and bring them to the most appropriate place.

[Diapason]

I caught a bit of Nick Munier talking about this on Ray D'Arcy's show the other morning, and I heard some of the responses too which were as wide-ranging as you'd expect. The whole issue certainly stirs up some passions.

Recent parenthood hasn't changed my view at all really, although I'm probably far more aware now of restaurants that are "suitable" as opposed to restaurants that aren't. Ultimately, a (small) number of parents have ruined this for everyone because they don't know how to act, and children under those circumstances become more of a nuisance than they need to be. I'd more or less share your views Unclepat.

[unclepat]

It's such tricky subject because implementing a blanket rule is so difficult when no two children are the same. The choice seems to be to tolerate the minority and risk ruining the experience for everyone else, or throw the baby out with the bathwater ( no pun intended) and ban all children, even those who are perfectly well behaved.

[Melendez]

There isn't much to disagree with in Unclepat's post. I suppose banning children under 12 from peak evening time tables, combined with light touch regulation (flows off the tongue now), is the way to go. If someone brings an undeclared six year old in at the wrong time you can gain kudos by tutting but obligingly allow it, as a favour, as long as he stays quiet. If he starts running around the restaurant with a toy transformer you are then justified in producing the meat cleaver.

[Old Tart]

Congratulations Pat! Will you be changing your handle to daddypat?

As a mother I've made a lot of sacrifices (sound of smallest violin playing), including missing out on visiting restaurants that I'd love, but the kids would hate. Now they're that bit older and relatively civilised, I can take them (almost) anywhere. That said, I've yet to meet a child that is happy to sit for hours at a table, including the one in their own home.

I would prefer it if a restaurant was upfront about not accepting children after a certain hour because then you have a reason for either picking it or elsewhere depending on your circumstances.

[unclepat]

Cheers OT, might have to review handle alright!

I think more restaurants would be upfront about how they feel but fear the backlash which would inevitably come. There appears to be a small shift in attitude though so watch this space.

Good point about children sitting for hours too. Most kids can manage to sit/eat/go within a reasonable timeframe but after a while boredom kicks in and in some cases, parents feel that it's the responsibility of the waiting staff to double as babysitters.

[bigjoe]

My 2 are 10 and 5. in the early days of eating out with them I would not dream of bringing them to an up market restaurant. With boredom / attention span we kept to the usual suspects (eddie rockets, TGI, Capt Americas)pubs with kids menu) were we knew we could get in and out fairly quickly. Kids food was always to be brought with out starters. Most of these places have colouring stuff for the kids which does keep them entertained for a short time.

now as they have grown up a bit and their tastes have developed we found we can go to some mid market bistros/cafes and enjoy a better experience. They have moved on from the nugget / sausage / burger & chips and love trying pasta's and different pizza etc. In a year or two we should be able to move on to the type of place i love to go.


It goes without saying all kids should have a DS lite on mute and also all parents phones must have angry birds on it.

[Melendez]

It goes without saying all kids should have a DS lite on mute and also all parents phones must have angry birds on it.

Not knocking it, and I was very grateful for such things at the time, but I've got a big lug in his teenage years who now thinks it's appropriate to listen to music on his phone when we go out for a meal. This makes me a bad parent as I didn't teach him the values of social interaction on a family outing when he was growing up. And he uses ketchup on every piece of beef he gets.

[Diapason]

I've got a big lug in his teenage years who now thinks it's appropriate to listen to music on his phone when we go out for a meal.

What's he listening to?

[Melendez]

I have no idea.

I'll have child protection services out to me now.

[Fishwife]

my kids are 8 and 6 years old. we have always felt that it's important to eat together as a family and this includes eating out. we want our children to eat and experience a wide range of foods. we tend to book an early table if we are going to a good restaurant and always make it clear that we have young children when we book.

Now i can be very smug and say that we have often had other diners come up to us in a restaurant and compliment us on how well behaved our kids are. People seem to be amazed that some kids can quite happliy seat, eat and be respectful in a restaurant.

On the other hand, when we have paid for a babysitter and want to go out together as a couple i am not very tolerant of crying babies or kids running around the place. I think kids should be allowed up to a certain time at night. Maybe 8pm could be a cut -off point?

[Diapason]

Fishwife, I think if most parents shared your views we wouldn't have the problem at all! I, like you, would really hope to be instilling such behaviour in our kid(s), because that's what happened when I was a kid. Eating out was a rare treat back then, of course, but even still the idea of misbehaving or running around a restaurant was just not on. I've been in nice restaurants where kids have been literally running wild, bumping into tables, etc. and parents seem to be oblivious. Those parents have now ruined it for everyone.

[scalder]

As parent of four, now ranging from 10 - 19, I'd concur with most of the sentiment here. After 8pm, its unfair to expect a very young child to be 100% predictable - most will be getting cranky, or at least unco-operative - it goes with the job description! - so any parent that expects to inflict the gamble of a tired and emotional toddler on fellow adult diners is chancing their arm IMHO. A very quiet (as in almost empty) venue may well have a quiet, appropriate corner to spare - so that an disturbance can be minimized, but it remains the restaurants choice whether they can monitor the situation to the mutual respect of ALL diners.

Even daytime dining requires social respect for other diners, unless its specifically a family-orientated venue that encourages a degree of hullabaloo? A restaurant isn't a library, but its not home turf either. Large groups can become very selfish, I think. If a bunch of parents are sat quaffing, while the dining room becomes their kids' creche, I'd consider it acceptable for the manager to ask if one of the parents could bring the mini thugs out for a bit of air while they finish up? I appreciate this is a hospitality minefield though.

I'm fully aware that some children (puffs with pride) have a good record. And I'd guess experienced staff can pick up on potential angels and devils pretty early on. But evening time must be effectively policed - in advance, if necessary - flagged on websites and entrances for sure - and always politely and firmly?

[Zibibbo]

I agree with a lot of the sentiments here also - especially that the minority of parents who do not control their kids ruin it for those who do. We bring ours (7&9) to restaurants regularly. They know how to behave, they stay at the table (mostly with the aid of colouring and a silent DS).

It is difficult for kids to avoid restlessness over the course of a long meal. I think that any restaurant that accepts/encourages children diners should supply some simple means of entertainment. In my place, we supply a box of colouring pencils and a few colouring sheets or blank sheets of paper. This always goes down a treat. It also keeps the kids occupied allowing the parents to have a better experience in our restaurant. It also means that the kids stay at the table and our service team are not expected to babysit or play 'dodge the kid'.

[unclepat]

I think if you go down the road of colouring books & kiddies menus then you've nailed your colours to the mast.